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Contesting log errors and their penalties
#1
Some questions came up about Calibro, QSO errors, and penalties. Sure enough, in the November Sweepstakes Information Packet of 29 Oct 2014 section 7 clearly states the penalties (electronic or paper). Specifically section 7.8:

Electronic Logs, one additional additional contact will be deleted for the following:
each dupe that is claimed for credit
each miscopied call sign
each busted exchange

However section 7.2 states that dupe QSO'sin electronic file are considered zero point QSO's and not penalized.

Seems to be a contradiction of sorts. I guess you can have a dupe just don't count it for credit and your ok (not penalized).

Huh

73,

KC1AXJ
73, Steve - KC1SA
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#2
(11-15-2014, 12:15 PM)KC1AXJ Wrote: Some questions came up about Calibro, QSO errors, and penalties. Sure enough, in the November Sweepstakes Information Packet of 29 Oct 2014 section 7 clearly states the penalties (electronic or paper). Specifically section 7.8:

Electronic Logs, one additional additional contact will be deleted for the following:
each dupe that is claimed for credit
each miscopied call sign
each busted exchange

However section 7.2 states that dupe QSOs in electronic file are considered zero point QSOs and not penalized.

Seems to be a contradiction of sorts. I guess you can have a dupe just don't count it for credit and your ok (not penalized).

Huh

73,

KC1AXJ

The contest software scores your log as you work them and give 0 points for a dupe. It is "smart" and knows when not to give points. The only time you are penalized for dupe is if you submit a paper log, cause they have to find them and take them out.

Also even though you claim a certain number of points and say you have a perfect log, the contest software that checks your log may know that that KL7 you worked had moved to the lower 48 so was not Alaska, so you may loose that multi but just get credit for a standard contact. (I'm assuming a contest where you only exchange a serial number and not any location information - so you don't know where he is by his CQ).

Finally the software does all the penalties and if you muss up a regular QSO you get penalized regular QSOs. The only time you loss multis, be it countries, zones, or sections is if you muss up a county, zone or section. Then you loose that multi and it penalizes you according to the rules but it won't take multis away from you indiscriminately. IE: you don't loose two multis if you mess up one and you don't loose a multi if you mess a regular QSO.

All in all don't worry about working the dupes with an electronic log. In fact last week a station called me in RTTY for QTC exchange. When I first told him QSO B4 he said NIL please dupe me which I did.

Al
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#3
Interesting website explaining Cabrillo Log Files here.
K1RCT - Rob
W1NRG Station Activities Manager
Home Email

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#4
(11-19-2014, 12:54 PM)KC1ACN Wrote: Interesting website explaining Cabrillo Log Files here.

I always submitted the logs for many of the club events and for FD and Sweeps we used my custom made duping program. I think we have been using it for more than 15 years now. It's almost impossible to have an error with my software .. But that's a long story.

Now that we are using the other two contest software of late, I'll be retiring my software.

However there is NO REASON to have any errors that cost you penalties. Not many people know it but you can submit your entry and the Cab engine will send you a report with the errors. You can then edit or delete the bad log entries and re-submit the log again. Each subsequent log you submit will replace the one currently on record completely.

Of course this doesn't help if that one QSO you needed for a clean sweep is just plain NG .. (not in ANYONE"s log) But if your entry has a typo or wrong section or check etc. and you have his data from another contact on another band etc. that IS correct, well just edit the QSO and re-submit the whole log again. You can keep re-submitting it.

Don't know why anyone would not re-submit a log to get rid of the "penalties" these days.

73, Rich WA1TRY
Rich - WA1TRY 
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#5
(11-24-2014, 06:49 PM)WA1TRY Wrote:
(11-19-2014, 12:54 PM)KC1ACN Wrote: Interesting website explaining Cabrillo Log Files here.

I always submitted the logs for many of the club events and for FD and Sweeps we used my custom made duping program. I think we have been using it for more than 15 years now. It's almost impossible to have an error with my software .. But that's a long story.

Now that we are using the other two contest software of late, I'll be retiring my software.

However there is NO REASON to have any errors that cost you penalties. Not many people know it but you can submit your entry and the Cab engine will send you a report with the errors. You can then edit or delete the bad log entries and re-submit the log again. Each subsequent log you submit will replace the one currently on record completely.

Of course this doesn't help if that one QSO you needed for a clean sweep is just plain NG .. (not in ANYONE"s log) But if your entry has a typo or wrong section or check etc. and you have his data from another contact on another band etc. that IS correct, well just edit the QSO and re-submit the whole log again. You can keep re-submitting it.

Don't know why anyone would not re-submit a log to get rid of the "penalties" these days.

73, Rich WA1TRY

Why fix it if it ain't broke? Why retire it?

If I had known, I would have submitted the log file to you first.

What do you need, the Cabrillo File or the .TRN files?
K1RCT - Rob
W1NRG Station Activities Manager
Home Email

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#6
Hi Rob,

I'm more than happy to see others finally getting involved. Sorry I couldn't be around much lately. Selling a house, getting a 2nd house renovated, and getting ready to move.

Regarding SS for 2014, as the club SAM I usually keep a copy of all the logs. But I think we can modernize the club somewhat. We have three options for archiving contest data for the club.

1. Keep all data stored here in the forum.
2. Or upload it to the club website.
3. Do both 1 & 2

I'm thinking it might be easy to store the actual logs and scores right here on the forum. It could be stored here instantly by who-ever is running the show and copies sent to Mark (K1PU) the webmaster for historical sake. To satisfy our club by-laws the final data should be reviewed by the club SAM.

The forum lends itself to be the ideal solution. All the banter and discussion is saved in one place, along with the results and logs available to anyone all the time.

It simplifies m job as SAM as I then only need to check the data and I don't have to handle paper .. <grin>

Perhaps at the end of the contest, those people in charge can start a new and last thread for SS 2014 where the subject is SS 2014 data and logs. Then that thread would be closed. I foresee in years to come club members in 2199 jumping to the MARC Contest forum where they can see who the ops and helpers were and the contest scores and soap box.

Al, N1API and myself are admins, but we can set up someone to be a moderator for the contest sub forum and he can manage things there and also close the final thread when all is said and done.

73, Rich WA1TRY.



(11-24-2014, 07:08 PM)KC1ACN Wrote:
(11-24-2014, 06:49 PM)WA1TRY Wrote:
(11-19-2014, 12:54 PM)KC1ACN Wrote: Interesting website explaining Cabrillo Log Files here.

I always submitted the logs for many of the club events and for FD and Sweeps we used my custom made duping program. I think we have been using it for more than 15 years now. It's almost impossible to have an error with my software .. But that's a long story.
Now that we are using the other two contest software of late, I'll be retiring my software.

However there is NO REASON to have any errors that cost you penalties. Not many people know it but you can submit your entry and the Cab engine will send you a report with the errors. You can then edit or delete the bad log entries and re-submit the log again. Each subsequent log you submit will replace the one currently on record completely.

Of course this doesn't help if that one QSO you needed for a clean sweep is just plain NG .. (not in ANYONE"s log) But if your entry has a typo or wrong section or check etc. and you have his data from another contact on another band etc. that IS correct, well just edit the QSO and re-submit the whole log again. You can keep re-submitting it.

Don't know why anyone would not re-submit a log to get rid of the "penalties" these days.

73, Rich WA1TRY

Why fix it if it ain't broke? Why retire it?

If I had known, I would have submitted the log file to you first.

What do you need, the Cabrillo File or the .TRN files?
Rich - WA1TRY 
Reply
#7
(11-24-2014, 07:08 PM)KC1ACN Wrote:
(11-24-2014, 06:49 PM)WA1TRY Wrote:
(11-19-2014, 12:54 PM)KC1ACN Wrote: Interesting website explaining Cabrillo Log Files here.

I always submitted the logs for many of the club events and for FD and Sweeps we used my custom made duping program. I think we have been using it for more than 15 years now. It's almost impossible to have an error with my software .. But that's a long story.

Now that we are using the other two contest software of late, I'll be retiring my software.

However there is NO REASON to have any errors that cost you penalties. Not many people know it but you can submit your entry and the Cab engine will send you a report with the errors. You can then edit or delete the bad log entries and re-submit the log again. Each subsequent log you submit will replace the one currently on record completely.

Of course this doesn't help if that one QSO you needed for a clean sweep is just plain NG .. (not in ANYONE"s log) But if your entry has a typo or wrong section or check etc. and you have his data from another contact on another band etc. that IS correct, well just edit the QSO and re-submit the whole log again. You can keep re-submitting it.

Don't know why anyone would not re-submit a log to get rid of the "penalties" these days.

73, Rich WA1TRY

Why fix it if it ain't broke? Why retire it?

If I had known, I would have submitted the log file to you first.

What do you need, the Cabrillo File or the .TRN files?

Some contest organization frown on "sanitizing" your logs. The message that the robot sends you is meant to tell you if you entered in the correct category. If say you are going over your log a day or two later and find that you got a call or section wrong and change it that is called "sanitizing" your log. By right you are not suppose to fix it and resubmit it. Probably done more than people realize but frowned upon. You are supposed to make any corrections before submitting your log and then once submitted leave it as is.


Al
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